Let's boycott our lovely game L2 and NCSoft!

Re: Let's boycott our lovely game L2 and NCSoft!

Postby Elmar » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:24 pm

Retrospect wrote:Image

Then...all the more they should consider this for the western market...


As you can see from the graph on the previous page, porting established PC-based games 1:1 to a mobile platform did not really work out in the long run (where "long run" means 3 months :mrgreen: ). Insofar NCsoft might actually fund the development of a connected system, trying to get the best of both worlds - PC and mobile. The advantage of Lineage Mobile Haste, from NCsoft's point of view, is that you teleport your character to the mobile server as it is on your home server (Chronos, Naia ...). This means any power items purchased from the L2Store come along and can be used on the mobile server, unlike with the Arena System, where everybody starts out at lvl 0 and the same No-Grade equipment on the battlefield server:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1639#p33308

So a player's investment is not lost - you get an Abundance Talisman on Chronos and can easier kill Freya on your smartphone. There is money to be made for NCsoft :D
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Re: Let's boycott our lovely game L2 and NCSoft!

Postby BergEr » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:59 am

Retrospect wrote:Why draw such a line between PC & mobile games?
IMO, large gaming corporations like NCSoft shld just develop "connected" games, e.g. raising a pet/agathion in a mobile gaming platform & being able to export these raised lvl stats to their PC equivalent.
If my memory is correct, in a past Playstation FF game, you can raise the lvl of your summons in a separate handheld tamagouchi type device & port it back to the actual FF game.
But that's just me dreaming... nowadays, corporations emphasized on earnings & development costs only...


Because currently none have had the time to make this in a good way (remember making an MMO is minimum a 5-10 year project). Any big game started before phone market exploded wont have phones included (unless they had someone in charge with amazing foresight) and any started after is years from comming to market.
I fully believe that in few years you can play your MMORPG on any device you have. It might not be ideal, but it should work (like dont try to do a siege or oly on phone, but maybe grinding mobs/quests).
The biggest issue for porting PC games to mobile is the controlls, its not so easy to port games where you have 30-50 keybinds and a mouse to a phone (unless we expect ppl to start carrying keyboard+mouse with them at all times).

Personally my hands hurt/cramp if im reading Reddit for 30min and I have a 6" phone, id never game on that shit.
But yes having players being able to to menial tasks on their phone in the game is good and not too hard to implement. It also keeps players locked into your game if they dont have to find other things to do while commuting etc.

Elmar wrote:
BergEr wrote:
Elmar wrote:The age of PC-based games is coming to an end; now it's all about mobile games. In the last fiscal quarter NCsoft generated a revenue of 550 million dollars from Lineage M vs. 15 million dollars from Lineage 2 worldwide.


PC gaming is bigger than ever and steadily increasing, some companies have just not managed to keep up. Though if you said that PC based MMORPGs are going down id believe you.


It's not me who says that, but Korean analysts and investors :P

But you are right, I should have said "PC based MMORPGs". That's what was discussed, in precisely these words, on the quarterly earnings press conference this Wednesday (어느 순간 PC MMORPG시장이 정지됐다 - "the market for PC based MMORPGs will sooner or later come to a complete standstill"):
http://www.inven.co.kr/webzine/news/?ne ... e=lineage2
(about 1/3 down the page, the 4th Q&A block from the bottom)

The person who asked the question went on to say that at present there is increasing discontent with mass-produced [PC-based] role-playing games (지금처럼 양산형 RPG에 관한 불만이 높아지고 있는) and asked whether in this situation mobile MMORPGs could be further developed (모바일 MMORPG가 더 발전할 수 있는). In replying to that question, Chief Financial Officer Yun Jae-su reiterated what he already said half a year ago, i.e. that NCsoft considers the existing PC-based games as basis, so-to-speak their stock-in-trade which can be ported to other platforms, not only mobile but also virtual reality, augmented reality and above all consoles (그래서 VR, AR 관련해서 개발하고 있다. 또한, PC 타이틀은 콘솔을 무조건 생각하고 있다).

In other words, (Asian) investors are severely worried about the decline of PC-based games and the rise of mobile games (you can see that on any public transport all over Asia), trying to egg on NCsoft to turn even more to the mobile sector, while the company is reluctant to abandon the intellectual capital they have so painstakingly developed in the past.

I myself don't play mobile games, I just occasionally watch others doing that. Aram as an experienced Lineage 2 Revolution player might know more, but I can't help the impression that massively multi-player games which have been developed for computer monitors where you can see and interact with dozens of players on a siege field can not really be ported to a small-screen device like a smartphone. Only future will tell. Fact is, NCsoft's revenue from mobile games (mainly Lineage [1] M and the royalties from Lineage 2 Revolution) dropped from 551,032 million Won to 327,101 million, i.e. by 41% within 3 months (1000 Won are 1 US dollar):
http://global.ncsoft.com/global/ir/quarterly.aspx


Yea its currently looking bad for MMORPGs, I think we need a whole new generation of players to fix it. Some that aren't raised with instant gratification from the age of 2 (when people put their kids infront of tablets).
I agree that they shouldn't drop the PC market to focus on phones, but thats because I believe that the phone gaming market will "crash" or atleast not be able to support any bigger games in the long run.
Doing cashgrabs in the phonemarket is profitable though but can hurt your brand and reputation severly.

Though I think its time to realize that halfarsed MMORPGs are a dying breed for now. And same with the big ones, its just not producing same amount of money as the big esport titles and you can't expect it to do so. Gotta take your slice of the market and keep it safe.
Like look at WoW, they hit 10million~ players with every new expansion. 1 year later atleast 60% of that is gone, two years and its down to 1-3mil players (im just doing educated guesses here though). But they poured tons of money into the game now, new patch every 72 days. And just two years after last expansion they are releasing a new one almost completly killing the lull/dead period they usually have in last patch (before they have had last patch up for over 1 year without new content).
They realized that its close to impossible to keep players in the game for long so now they work around having players just play for a month, take a months break and then return. Or even longer breaks before returning.
And with the constant pushes to keep the casuals comming back every so often they keep the game more alive for the hardcore players. But the core group of hardcore players is shrinking steadily anyway.

Who knows, maybe MMORPGS will make a return when "our" generation start hitting retirement =D

Hope this text is coherent, im very tired =D
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Re: Let's boycott our lovely game L2 and NCSoft!

Postby Elmar » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:07 am

Senior citizens have a lot of time. If video game companies arrange their business model in a way that not only the retired engineer with a decent pension but also the widowed housewife who never worked herself, i.e. gets no pension, and is now out of her husbands income can play, that would be a nice and ever increasing market segment. Recently several old friends of mine have died at the ripe age of 100+, having stayed amazingly fit until shortly before the end. Nevertheless it would be dishonest to claim that we older people don't feel deterioration setting in from the age of 50 onwards (I am 55 myself). Insofar I find for example the click-to-move method in Lineage 2 less stressful than the WASD movement in World of Warcraft. There I must control my character at all times, while in L2 there are always short periods where the Dwarfy finds her own way around smaller rocks and trees. And as you pointed out above, a smartphone display is far too fiddly for rheumatic fingers.

For similar reasons you will find few old people who play first-person shooters like Counterstrike - we simply don't have the quick reactions of a 20 year old. The same goes for multiplayer online battle arenas like League of Legends. Even the PvP in Lineage 2 is way too fast for senior citzens. But if they make PvE-only servers like the old Gallint in Korea (that was for teenagers; PvP is forbidden for minors over there), then role-playing games with their emphasis on social interaction and long-term goals would be ideal for the older generation :)
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