What is the future of NC West?

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Elmar » Tue May 29, 2018 6:40 pm

KenLee wrote:Btw, you said you're a lawyer and I don't know much about this subject. Some people were talking about f2p games lacking certain regulations and they can operate without a gambling license. Only in the extreme cases, when you get items from in game gambling, items that are required to advance and you have to pay for that gambling, only then they can do something to you. Otherwise these items are considered vapor items and worth nothing outside the game. Do you know something about it?


It's different from country to country - Korea has stricter youth-protection laws than the USA - and in the USA from state to state - Nevada has more liberal gambling laws than Washington State. An item being necessary to play the game should indeed not be obtainable by real-money gambling. NCsoft's response to this will be that for hunting at the Hot Springs you don't need any Brooch Jewels at all; nobody forces you to level up to 99+. Another factor is that, at least in Korea, real-money expenditure is strictly regulated for minors. For reference check this:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=1974&start=80#p36539

In Korea, Lineage 2 can only be played by people who are at least 18 years old (they can check the age via the Resident Registration Number you need to make an account). At NCWest, the game can technically be played by children of 13+. Such kids probably don't have a credit card, but for example in Germany you are legally permitted to work from 15 years on, and those apprentices all have a checking account, i.e. access to PayPal. So if you sue NCsoft it will be for that, the problem being that if legislators get too insistent, they will simply IP-block Europeans or move the company headquarter to the Cayman Islands or, most probably, simply shut down the operations because without mentally impaired children to buy their pixels it's simply not profitable enough any more.
User avatar
Elmar
 
Posts: 4960
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 6:52 pm
Location: Germany/China

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Quitted » Tue May 29, 2018 7:05 pm

True that Elmar.
+ if you are selling something to someone else who is high on alchool, drugs, or has a gambling disease you know since the very beginning that he can't control his own behaviour.
In EU that's enough to go in front of a civil court to get a refound of all you have spent (it's called einen ungültigen Vertrag abgeschlossen haben in Deutsch)
+ criminal court
Quitted
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 10:09 pm

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Dawe » Tue May 29, 2018 7:39 pm

I kinda am, i don't like the item shop (in my opinion, most of the items they selling are uselless anyway) but i like/d the game, so i want to paid them something.
Dawe
 
Posts: 242
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 2:10 pm

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby KenLee » Tue May 29, 2018 9:03 pm

Elmar wrote:
KenLee wrote:Btw, you said you're a lawyer and I don't know much about this subject. Some people were talking about f2p games lacking certain regulations and they can operate without a gambling license. Only in the extreme cases, when you get items from in game gambling, items that are required to advance and you have to pay for that gambling, only then they can do something to you. Otherwise these items are considered vapor items and worth nothing outside the game. Do you know something about it?


It's different from country to country - Korea has stricter youth-protection laws than the USA - and in the USA from state to state - Nevada has more liberal gambling laws than Washington State. An item being necessary to play the game should indeed not be obtainable by real-money gambling. NCsoft's response to this will be that for hunting at the Hot Springs you don't need any Brooch Jewels at all; nobody forces you to level up to 99+. Another factor is that, at least in Korea, real-money expenditure is strictly regulated for minors. For reference check this:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=1974&start=80#p36539

In Korea, Lineage 2 can only be played by people who are at least 18 years old (they can check the age via the Resident Registration Number you need to make an account). At NCWest, the game can technically be played by children of 13+. Such kids probably don't have a credit card, but for example in Germany you are legally permitted to work from 15 years on, and those apprentices all have a checking account, i.e. access to PayPal. So if you sue NCsoft it will be for that, the problem being that if legislators get too insistent, they will simply IP-block Europeans or move the company headquarter to the Cayman Islands or, most probably, simply shut down the operations because without mentally impaired children to buy their pixels it's simply not profitable enough any more.

I remember when it was p2p it was age restricted or needed parents approval or something, not really sure since I didn't have to deal with this myself. Here people can work from age 16+ but in order to open a bank account and have a card you need to come with a parent. Even paypal doesn't allow opening an account for age under 18, you need a parent to do it for you. Overall, all these responsibilities fall into the parents hands and not the game company if young people fall into these gambling addictions. They are kind of protected. It's like when teens buy smokes for younger kids with their id, it's not the seller's fault.

I agree that this is too much. Too much random boxes, wheel of (mis)fortune and all the casino crap they keep inventing to grab people's money. I myself haven't bought a lottery ticket in rl since 20+ years ago. I felt like it could have become an addiction and it wasn't productive at all, so one day I said stop. But I can see now how younger people are easily influenced and easy to fall into online gambling traps. You don't need to have an addiction already. The competitive spirit is quite alive in younger people and 'this guy has it and I don't have it' is enough of a motivator for them to spend money online, even more when these lootboxes of deceptions are packaged so nicely with lies. So I never buy rng based stuff in games with rl money, not even if it's rng cosmetics, but I've been tempted once in a blue moon. I have nothing with spending money on cash shops but you give me the real deal or nothing at all.
KenLee
 
Posts: 401
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:32 am

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Aram » Sat Jun 02, 2018 3:44 pm

Continuing the discussion about chances of L2store event items, I want to show you this post at korean board. Gandalf from Bartz server was publish a few sheets of drop tables current event "The Search for Lost Relics"

I put icons in a sheets to be easier to understand.
Image
Drop from Dragon's Relic Box
Image

Drop from Shining Dragon's Relic Box
Image
Last edited by Aram on Sat Jun 02, 2018 5:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Aram
 
Posts: 348
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:01 am
Location: Forest of the Dead

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Elmar » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:03 pm

The interesting thing here is, those probabilities are official numbers, to be found (after some searching :D ) on the NCKorea L2Store page:
http://lineage2nshop.plaync.com/lineage ... ageIndex=1

Apparently the Korean law was changed with effect of the beginning of this year, forcing video game comapnies to publish those rates (DivineScrap's comment of today under Gandalf's post). If there is a gambling event at NCWest again, one could go to this page, check whether something similar already ran in Korea and get an idea about the rates (which might of course have been changed for the export version):
http://lineage2nshop.plaync.com/lineage ... ement/list

All the way at the bottom of the upper page is the Brooch Jewel compounding rate for the current NCWest event :mrgreen:
User avatar
Elmar
 
Posts: 4960
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 6:52 pm
Location: Germany/China

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Quitted » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:34 pm

:mrgreen:

Well my bet is that those tables were requested by chinese laws and koreans can read chinese so :lol:
Same went for overwatch

Btw as soon as freya will be merged with naia deng last nail in the coffin.
Then all to chronos before the farewell.
Hilarious thing. Innova, as a licencer, gets the last patch before ncwest lead by the daughter of NCSoft CO.
Really hilarious.
Quitted
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 10:09 pm

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Elmar » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:49 pm

Quitted wrote:Well my bet is that those tables were requested by chinese laws and koreans can read chinese so :lol:

This might of course have something to do with the gambling laws in the People's Republic of China, like the Privacy page on the NCWest website has been caused by European Community law. But what Aram posted above is not hacked data but information directly from the NCKorea website, published by the company itself. Gandalf is a player, but only NCsoft staff can post on http://lineage2nshop.plaync.com. That's their L2Store, as safe from player interference as Fort Knox :D
User avatar
Elmar
 
Posts: 4960
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 6:52 pm
Location: Germany/China

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Quitted » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:57 pm

Well I was thinking. Ok to get 1 jewel 5 you will need at least 1.000 boxes medium rate 1.500 = 3.000 usd
To get 1 jewel 6 you will need 6.000 usd.
To get 6 jewels 6 you will need 36.000 usd.
With 3.000 usd you can have a real nasa gaming laptop like this one
https://www.asus.com/uk/ROG-Republic-Of ... RUS-GX501/
Eventually logging in on ncwest zaken server someone can drop it too :)
Quitted
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue May 22, 2018 10:09 pm

Re: What is the future of NC West?

Postby Elmar » Sat Jun 02, 2018 5:21 pm

For comparison, in the current Dragon Relics event CaptainHook spent 400,000 Won (around 400 US dollars), and the best item he got was a Kaliel's Energy (Desire), the 17th item in the reward table above, dropping with a probability of 0.045%. I got several of those for free from Beloa's Supply Items by doing the daily Dimensional Rift quest :D
User avatar
Elmar
 
Posts: 4960
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 6:52 pm
Location: Germany/China

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest